Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system
Posted by Randip on July 10, 2008
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Joined: 06/10/2008
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Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system
Hi Summy,

From your last response I guess you concede defeat. Only defeated people resort to such cheapshots.

Our Rehat Maryada clearly defines what can be eaten, and that icludes ritually slaughtered meat.

What is Kuttha meat?

Punjabi-English Dictionary, Punjabi University, Dept. of Punjabi Lexicography, Published Dec. 1994. "Kuttha: meat of animal or fowl slaughtered slowly as prescribed by Islamic law."
Punjabi English Dictionary, Singh Bros., Amritsar "Kuttha: Tortured, killed according to Mohammedan law."

In the Rehit Marayada (http://www.sgpc.net/rehat_maryada/section_six.html), Section Six, it states:
The undermentioned four transgressions (tabooed practices) must be avoided
1. Dishonouring the hair;
2. Eating the meat of an animal slaughtered the Muslim way(Kutha);
3. Cohabiting with a person other than one`s spouse
4. Using tobacco.
Sikh Rehit Maryada

There have been some quarters who have been at pains to create confusion over the word Kuttha (like you Summy). There is no confusion over this word, and the Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji is proof of this.
In the following Ang Guru Nanak condemns Brahmins, who serve their Muslim rulers stating they are acting like pseudo-Muslims. In this Ang there is a line which clearly refers to Kuttha as meat which has had Muslim prayers read over it. Kuttha, however, can meat any meat that is killed in a ritualistic manner.

mehlaa 1.
maanas khaanay karahi nivaaj
.
chhuree vagaa-in tin gal taag.
tin ghar barahman pooreh naad.
unHaa bhe aavahi o-ee saad.
koorhee raas koorhaa vaapaar.
koorh bol karahi aahaar.
saram Dharam kaa dayraa door.
naanak koorh rahi-aa bharpoor.
mathai tikaa tayrh Dhotee kakhaa-ee.
hath chhuree jagat kaasaa-ee.
neel vastar pahir hoveh parvaan.
malaychh Dhaan lay poojeh puraan.
abhaakhi-aa kaa kuthaa bakraa khaanaa.
cha-ukay upar kisai na jaanaa.
day kai cha-ukaa kadhee kaar.
upar aa-ay baithay koorhi-aar.
mat bhitai vay mat bhitai.
ih ann asaadaa fitai.
tan fitai fayrh karayn.
man joothai chulee bharayn.
kaho naanak sach Dhi-aa-ee-ai.
such hovai taa sach paa-ee-ai.

First Mehl:
The man-eaters say their prayers.
Those who wield the knife wear the sacred thread around their necks.
In their homes, the Brahmins sound the conch.
They too have the same taste.
False is their capital, and false is their trade.
Speaking falsehood, they take their food.
The home of modesty and Dharma is far from them.
O Nanak, they are totally permeated with falsehood. The sacred marks are on their foreheads, and the saffron loin-cloths are around their waists;
in their hands they hold the knives - they are the butchers of the world!
Wearing blue robes, they seek the approval of the Muslim rulers.
Accepting bread from the Muslim rulers, they still worship the Puraanas.
They eat the meat of the goats, killed after the Muslim prayers are read over them,
but they do not allow anyone else to enter their kitchen areas.
They draw lines around them, plastering the ground with cow-dung.
The false come and sit within them.
They cry out, "Do not touch our food,
this food of ours will be polluted!
But with their polluted bodies, they commit evil deeds.
With filthy minds, they try to cleanse their mouths.
Says Nanak, meditate on the True Lord.
If you are pure, you will obtain the True Lord.
Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji


 and  further more this is why we have Jhatka

We must give the rationale behind prescribing jhatka meat as the approved food for the Sikhs. According to the ancient Aryan Hindu tradition, only such meat as is obtained from an animal which is killed with one stroke of the weapon causing instantaneous death is fit for human consumption. However, with the coming of Islam into India and the Muslim political hegemony, it became a state policy not to permit slaughter of animals for food, in any other manner, except as laid down in the Quran - the kosher meat prepared by slowly severing the main blood artery of the throat of the animal while reciting verses from the Quran. It is done to make slaughter a sacrifice to God and to expiate the sins of the slaughter. Guru Gobind Singh took a rather serious view of this aspect of the whole matter. He, therefore, while permitting flesh to be taken as food repudiated the whole theory of this expiatory sacrifice and the right of ruling Muslims to impose iton the non-Muslims. Accordingly, he made jhatka meat obligatory for those Sikhs who may be interested in taking meat as a part of their food.
Sikhism, A Complete Introduction, Dr. H.S.Singha & Satwant Kaur, Hemkunt Press



And one semitic practice clearly rejected in the Sikh code of conduct is eating flesh of an animal cooked in ritualistic manner; this would mean kosher and halal meat. The reason again does not lie in religious tenet but in the view that killing an animal with a prayer is not going to enoble the flesh. No ritual, whoever conducts it, is going to do any good either to the animal or to the diner. Let man do what he must to assuage his hunger. If what he gets, he puts to good use and shares with the needy, then it is well used and well spent, otherwise not.
Sikhs and Sikhism, Dr. I.J.Singh, Manohar Publishers.

I would argue that according to this any ritually slaughtered meat is forbidden for a Sikh and Kuttha means any ritually slaughtered meat.

Now please debate these points in a rational manner Summy and cut the abuse. Who knows you may even pass your exams ones day?



Discussion Thread
  The `caste` system   Kamal06/26/2008
          Re: The `caste` system   Randip06/26/2008
                  Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy06/26/2008
                          Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip06/27/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy06/28/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy06/28/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   jamil06/28/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip06/28/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy06/28/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   MuayThai06/30/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip06/30/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip06/30/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy07/01/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   jamil07/02/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   MuayThai07/03/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/04/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy07/04/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/05/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy07/06/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/07/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy07/07/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   jamil07/08/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   MuayThai07/08/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy07/09/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/10/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/11/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy07/11/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/11/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/11/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/11/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   jamil07/12/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy07/13/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/13/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   MuayThai07/16/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/16/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy07/16/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/17/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/17/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy07/19/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   jamil07/19/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/20/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Summy07/20/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Randip07/20/2008
                                  Re: Re: Re: The `caste` system   Joti08/08/2008

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